It’s great to start a new episode of The Search Session. I’m Gianluca Fiorelli, and in this episode, I’m speaking with Bengü Sarıca Dinçer, an SEO consultant from Turkey specializing in the SaaS industry. We explore what modern SaaS SEO really looks like beyond traffic and rankings.
She shares her perspective on how to measure real business impact, align SEO with revenue goals, and adapt strategies to an AI-driven search landscape where visibility, influence, and user journeys matter more than ever.
Take a quick look at the main topics we cover in this episode:
Re-educating stakeholders on SEO KPIs: moving beyond traffic and rankings, which are now superficial, and focusing instead on tracking the full user journey and all influence points rather than just the first or last touchpoint.
Content built for users’ intent, not traffic: why SaaS SEO must focus on funnel-driven, solution-oriented content that drives retention and long-term value.
Search everywhere as a strategy: why SEO must integrate with social and emerging platforms by treating every audience touchpoint as a potential search channel.
Proving TOFU value with GA4: using returning visits, user journey tracking, custom events, and engagement signals to demonstrate that top-of-funnel content drives long-term impact beyond initial traffic.
Documentation content as a conversion driver: how well-structured SaaS documentation can build authority, attract solution-seeking users, and directly contribute to purchases when tracked properly with GA4.
Balancing AI visibility vs. traffic loss: why SEO should prioritize discoverability and brand influence across AI platforms, treating bot-blocking as a business decision rather than reacting purely to traffic concerns.
Using AI as a copilot, not a decision-maker: leveraging AI to validate ideas, outline thinking, and assess risks while keeping human expertise and experimentation at the center of strategy.
Discovering unexpected channels: how analyzing traffic sources and personal platform usage led to identifying TikTok as a potential high-value channel for SaaS visibility.
International SaaS prioritization: why true localization goes beyond translation, requiring revenue-driven geographic focus and selective investment in markets that demonstrate real business impact.
Overcoming introversion in SEO: how pushing past fear of judgment and engaging with supportive communities can build confidence, expand networks, and accelerate professional growth.
Let’s begin our meaningful conversation.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer
SEO Manager at Designmodo
Bengü is an SEO consultant specializing in SaaS and growth-driven search strategies. With a strong focus on measuring real business impact, she helps companies align SEO with revenue goals, user journeys, and long-term retention.
She is currently an SEO Manager at Designmodo, a company that provides email and web design tools and resources, helping users easily create email campaigns and websites without complex development.
She is also a regular contributor to multiple industry publications, including the Designmodo blog. More recently, she has gained growing recognition in the conference community, speaking at industry events and sharing her expertise on SaaS SEO.
Transcript
Gianluca Fiorelli: Hi, welcome. I’m Gianluca Fiorelli, and welcome back to The Search Session. Today, we have, it may seem like quite a coincidence, another Turkish SEO.
We had Yagmur Simsek before, then Metehan Yeşilyurt, and now it’s time for another SEO from Turkey, which is quite fascinating because we always think about SEO in Anglo-Saxon terms, with many people coming from the US, the UK, or, in general, from Nordic and Central Europe.
But this is a sign that SEO is very well executed and done in other countries as well, even if they often go under the radar.
So, who is our guest today? She’s the SaaS SEO Manager for Designmodo. She also does some freelance SEO consulting, and she has spoken at BrightonSEO and Search ’n Stuff. She has contributed wonderful articles to Search Engine Land, Search Engine Journal, and, in the past, to Wix, Moz, and Sitebulb, as well as to our host, Advanced Web Ranking.
Her name is—let’s try to pronounce it correctly—Bengü Sarıca. And the second surname, I’d like her to pronounce it because I’m sure I’m going to get it wrong. So, Bengü Sarıca…
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Dinçer.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Okay, fantastic. Bengü, how are you doing?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Great. It’s really amazing to see you, and thank you for hosting me on this podcast.
Gianluca Fiorelli: You’re more than welcome. I was really looking forward to having you as my guest. I forgot to say that, besides all your work as an SEO, you are also supporting the growth of SEO and helping spread the Turkish flavor of SEO, supporting Yagmur Simsek for Search ‘n Stuff.
Search ‘n Stuff is a growing event in London, and there’s also a second event co-founded in Antalya, which is really fantastic. And all these, apart from the classic Search ‘n Stuff meetups.
So, Bengü, you’ve been quite prolific lately in writing and publishing articles. I really appreciate it, especially because they’re about something quite complicated right now: how to measure things in this complicated time, where things like attribution are substantially messed up.
It’s complicated not only from an SEO perspective, but also for all the other channels to really understand how people come to our website and what the real touchpoints are. This uncertainty is not the best thing when you’re trying to set up a strategy.
KPIs for the Modern SaaS Funnel
Gianluca Fiorelli: Talking about strategy and alignment, in your article—and correct me if I’m wrong—you were really stressing how SEO should talk with executive stakeholders and educate them about SEO metrics. And now those metrics are somehow changing.
What do you mean by re-educating executive stakeholders about how to measure things?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: As you said, things are a bit complicated, and everything has been changing very frequently these days. But the only thing we really care about is the user’s perspective, so we should focus on that.
That’s why I wanted to share my thoughts about the KPIs we want to track, and we should track. The article published on Search Engine Journal was about which KPIs we should consider for our near future.
Because traffic numbers, rankings, and all those traditional metrics are now kind of superficial. They don’t represent the full story about our users, our performance, or our website. So we need to shift our focus a bit.
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Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Attribution and certainty are the main problems for most SEO people in this industry. But I have always believed that the first touchpoint is not the most important one. What really matters is the whole journey.
I’ve always focused on tracking the entire user journey and the influence points along the way, giving credit to the whole process and to all channels involved, not just the first or the last one.
That’s the perspective I explained in that article, if that makes sense.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, and we will surely link to the article in the description of the video.
I think you touched on a very interesting point, something I really miss from the old Google Analytics, which was the contributed attribution. It’s not that you can’t measure it now, with GA4, for instance, but it’s somehow buried in all the configurations, and eventually you have to create specific reports and so on.
I think it’s really cool, not just for SEO, but how SEO can integrate and collaborate with other channels in order to amplify visibility and the effectiveness of this visibility.
Another question, more related to the specifics of SaaS SEO, which you specialize in. One of the classic problems—also in the past, when everything was a bit clearer—is traffic generation and high churn.
How to create opportunities for traffic generation, but make sure this traffic is not just random traffic landing on your website? Ideally, a percentage of it will become subscribers, or maybe not immediately subscribers. So, how can you integrate this kind of traffic, which sometimes is not considered very valuable, into something that can help, for instance, with LTV, like lifetime value?
In the sense of people who subscribe, making them return and maintain their attention on your brand as a SaaS. Or people who discover you and keep your brand in mind after the visit.
How can you combine this kind of information from data into a strategy for content and SEO?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Regarding that kind of content structure and strategy, I can say that I’m very lucky to have our team at Designmodo. They give me space to test my ideas.
My perspective here is not about appealing to everyone in the universe. It’s about focusing on our users’ intent, which is not easy. We know what our users are looking for, but there’s also a lot of noise created by competitors and by us as well. And not only direct competitors—search is everywhere now, so users are exposed to many different things.
Instead of chasing keywords, I focus on creating some funnel-end content. People are searching for literally everything. We can find thousands, millions, or gazillions of keywords, but in the end, they are just a waste of time if we’re only looking for traffic.
Especially in a SaaS environment, you have very limited time to appeal to your audience. You shouldn’t distract their attention while they are looking for a solution.
So you should create content or a solution just for their necessity. Otherwise, it’s a waste. You have to be cautious about what your audience is looking for and what they really need. It’s probably the same for other industries as well, but I’m speaking specifically for SaaS.
If you want users to revisit your website, you need to give them a reason. That’s why I recommend giving clear answers rather than hiding information inside content or relying on structural tricks on the website.
I think honesty and being genuinely helpful are the keys to our strategy. And I believe it works when it comes to bringing massive amounts of traffic. Because traffic is just a number, but your visibility, discoverability, and recognition matter much more.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, and this reminds me of a classic strategy in SaaS, the so-called product-led SEO. Instead of talking about broad topics, since you’re not an academic or a journalist, even if specialized, you talk about the product and how it solves the pain points people are feeling in relation to the topic you want to address.
I think you nailed it. In this way, when you talk about the product in a way that is not overly commercial at first, you can really answer the question and be helpful.
But you also mentioned this search-everywhere situation, where people touch all the places where someone can eventually start a search or be triggered to do one.
So I wonder how integrated your work as an SEO is with, I don’t know if this is the case at Designmodo or with other clients you collaborate with, when it comes to integrating SEO strategy with social media strategy.
Because in some niches, search engines may not be the place where people are first triggered to search. Maybe it’s Reddit. Maybe it’s TikTok, Instagram, or YouTube. How has the integration between your work as an SEO and the work of colleagues or partners in other channels evolved?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: I really like the term “search everywhere optimization”. I’m sure you’ve already heard it. It’s kind of my mantra right now.
I treat all platforms as search channels. That includes social platforms like TikTok and Reddit and even tools like ChatGPT and others. This approach helps me stay consistent everywhere.
I believe that if my audience is on a platform, then it is a search place. Because they are looking for something. If I can create recognizable content for them on that platform, then that platform becomes a very good search channel.
It’s not necessary to be everywhere. But if my audience is there and looking for something, then I should be there. This is my perspective.
Gianluca Fiorelli: That’s a totally valid perspective. Sometimes I push it a bit further and say that search everywhere is not just about being present on TikTok or YouTube and so on, but also about being visible across all the SERP features in Google.
For example, if a SERP feature is constantly YouTube, then you should create something on YouTube so you can also appear in that YouTube box in Google, and so on.
When you start thinking about search this way, the next logical step is understanding what actually appears in tanking helps you analyze SERPs at scale, identify all the features triggered by your keyword she SERPs for your target keywords.
Advanced Web Ret, and track how visible your brand is across each of them, not just the traditional organic results.
This makes it much easier to spot patterns and opportunities, like when YouTube or another feature keeps showing up and signals that you should create content for that format too.
Try Advanced Web Ranking for free and see exactly how your keywords perform across the entire SERP landscape.
Measuring the Value of Top-of-Funnel (TOFU) Content
Gianluca Fiorelli: I’d like to return for a moment to the analytics side and return to, let's say, top-of-funnel traffic, even if it’s qualified, and then conversion.
In your article, you described how to set up and analyze the journey people are taking. Could you synthesize how you use GA4 scoping to prove the value of this TOFU traffic, which is usually very neglected, and many people are saying we should stop writing TOFU content right now? In part, that may be true, but how can you demonstrate the value of still creating the right top-of-funnel content?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: For GA4, I look at many things. Believe it or not, I’m a huge fan of GA4. For me, it’s more helpful than Universal Analytics.
For top-of-funnel content, I still look at traffic numbers and sessions, and their influence on the journey that continues afterward. But especially for top-of-funnel content, returning visits are the most important thing for me to track.
I care about whether that content brings users back, because that’s the main purpose of this type of content. Bringing a user back is not common for every type of content. But if it happens, then I pay close attention to the structure of that specific content.
I also configure many custom events for blog articles. I track whether users interact with elements within the content, how they react to certain paragraphs, calls to action, banners, or buttons. In general, I look at multiple elements for just one piece of content.
So it becomes helpful to understand whether our top-of-funnel content is working or not. Whether it directs people to find the right answers or guides them toward solution pages.
I also want to add one more thing: user duration on the website is something I care about. But I care when the duration is shorter. Because it can mean that the user already found the answer in the content and then left the website, which is okay. But what really matters to me is whether they come back later. That’s very valuable for me.
The Hidden Conversion Power of Documentation Pages
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, and while you were talking, I was thinking about a classic type of content many SaaS companies have. Not really blog posts and not exactly landing pages, but documentation pages.
These are pages where companies describe in practical terms how the tool works and give tips on how to use it. Obviously, the main target is existing subscribers. But many times these pages also appear for people searching for solutions.
These pages can be helpful for them to understand before subscribing, whether the solution the SaaS is proposing is the right one for them.
Check out the The Search Session episodes on SaaS:
Discover the future of search for SaaS with Gaetano DiNardi: from AI and LLMs to shifting user behavior and what actually drives conversions today.
Learn how to avoid the most common SaaS strategy mistakes with Himani Kankaria: from funnel imbalance to outdated content rules and how to fix them before they cost you revenue.
Go give them a listen!
Gianluca Fiorelli: So I wonder, based on the kind of tracking you do—first-time visitors, returning visitors—if you see that working well. Because sometimes we think these pages are not meant for conversion or for contributing to conversion.
But have you seen that documentation pages, if well-executed, are able to establish that kind of authority and trust that makes people want to subscribe to your truth?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Have you noticed something like this?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes, especially for one of our projects. Recently, I observed many purchases coming from documentation pages that we had just built.
It sounds very successful because in that project, we don’t have other content types like blog sites or additional helpful resources. We only have the documentation section, and it brings purchases. That’s awesome.
I track user IDs in GA4 to understand whether those people are actually becoming customers or if they are just looking for a solution, finding the answer there, and then leaving.
GA4 is my second hint in finding whether a content type is really helpful or not. So yes, documentation can also bring very valuable outcomes.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, and then there’s the classic dilemma. I don’t know how you are solving it.
We know that this kind of content is perfect fuel for AI systems to create synthetic answers. One radical decision could be to block every bot except Google. But if you block Google for AI Overviews or AI Mode, you are essentially blocking Google for everything.
But let’s say for ChatGPT, Claude, especially Claude, if you’re on the technical side, you can eventually choose to block it at least from the training model.
But obviously, you also need to be visible, because more and more people are using these platforms to inform themselves.
So how do you balance this dilemma? I know I’m going to lose some traffic because I’m visible there and sometimes people will be satisfied with the answer. But at least I need to be visible there, so people will remember me better.
How do you balance this situation, which is quite excruciating for an SEO?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: We already went through that path about a year ago. We accepted that traffic is just numbers. It’s incomplete if you want to understand the full journey.
So we should focus on influence points, which can be any other platforms and channels. We should invest in being memorable and recognizable. That doesn’t mean being visible everywhere, but being discoverable where our users are.
Our strategy has already shifted in that direction.
When it comes to blocking AI bots and similar systems, I believe that’s more of a business decision than an SEO decision. If you want to be discoverable, you shouldn’t block search engines and these new AI platforms.
But if you have a lot of security-related information on your website, then of course you should act carefully and protect your users and their data. In that case, blocking may make sense.
For now, my choice is not to block them.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Interesting. I think it’s a very justified and logical position, especially after more than 12 months of dealing with AI.
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Using AI as a Copilot, Not a Decision-Maker
Gianluca Fiorelli: And talking about AI, I know building AI models is not your specialty, but we all use AI in our work now. I think it was on Search Engine Land, last May, that you wrote an article about how you are using AI to help yourself.
From your answers, it’s clear you deal with a lot of data. AI can be a strong ally in making sense of that data, especially for finding patterns that are difficult to detect manually, even with filters.
So how do you practically use AI in your job?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: I use AI as a copilot, which was the main headline of that article, as you remember.
There’s no reason to deny it, I use it. Even though I’m not a huge fan of the AI hype. Not the technology itself, but the hype around it.
AI results are cumulative results. It is trained to gather information from the web, from the whole ecosystem. So it’s like working with every single person in the world. And that’s not really my type.
Maybe I sound arrogant when it comes to AI, but I prefer to put my own brain on the table. If I have expertise, I should bring my authentic perspective instead of relying only on collaborative or cumulative information.
Because I always say, even if it may sound wrong to most people, this is just me. I usually experiment with something first, and then I see whether it’s the right or wrong way to continue. That’s my method.
So I use AI to validate these kinds of things that might work for others or for me before making them live. It helps me understand and calculate the risks before taking action.
So yes, AI is very helpful to outline ideas and validate creative thinking before implementing it. But I don’t use AI as a tool to move forward by itself. It just helps me decide something.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, I totally agree with you. I never give the keys of the car to AI to take decisions for me.
For instance, I use it quite a lot with very big Search Console datasets. Let’s say 60 months of Search Console data.
I don’t know if you do the same, but I have this kind of methodology. First of all, I create a very precise data sheet. In this sheet, I also add a column with events. These events can be classic Google events like core updates, spam updates, indexing problems, or issues during specific days. But I also include a log of what the client has done on certain days, what happened on other days, and so on.
Then I describe the sheet very clearly to the machine. Usually I use Claude for this. And I tell it: be very analytical. Don’t make judgments. Just tell me what you see. What kind of patterns do you find so I can focus on them?
If it identifies patterns, then I check whether there is something that can be related for further analysis. I look for correlation, not causation, in the data and the events I added to the column.
I think this is quite an interesting way to use the data: let AI see the data and tell me what to do.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yeah, exactly.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Let AI design the data in a way that I can use it better.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes, I think so. I also use AI to analyze log files because it’s a very time-consuming task to understand common patterns and decide what the problem is. So yes, AI is very helpful to be more productive in that regard.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, and another way I use AI is with Gemini. I use Gemini in combination with NotebookLM.
I created a NotebookLM with all the official documentation from Google, Bing, and posts written by people I really trust on specific topics, for instance, everything about technical SEO. Then I ask it, based on what it discovers in the patterns and documentation, so it’s not choosing information that is not trustworthy for me, to give me ideas, and then I start brainstorming.
We know our job, so we can immediately see if it’s saying something stupid or something that could be interesting to investigate further. So again, I use it as a sparring partner, not as someone who takes decisions.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: It’s also very useful for researching specific topics. I always research the newest trends, because we have so many newsletters to follow.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, too many things to read, and not enough time.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes, exactly. That’s why I use AI to summarize everything and then see if there is something to consider for the near future. So, yes.
Discovering New Channels: Is TikTok the Next SaaS Growth Lever?
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, and we were talking before about search everywhere. Do you have any curious or interesting experiences where you discovered that your buyer persona was present in an unusual channel? A channel you didn’t initially consider relevant for that kind of audience or service that you’re proposing.
And if you made this kind of discovery, how did you discover it? Because sometimes discovering the right channel is harder than acting on it. Because we cannot do marketing on every channel randomly. So how do you discover the right one?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Let me think.
Recently, I checked many channels that were bringing traffic to our main website. One of them was WebDo, which was not quite interesting, as I considered that our audience is mostly designers and developers.
I usually track traffic channels using analytics tools. But I’m also a TikTok user, and I use it every day, maybe two hours.
It’s quite interesting. I’m just using it for my pleasure. I really enjoy scrolling on TikTok. But I saw that many SaaS companies use it very efficiently, and I’ve been influenced by their content.
That’s why I thought it could be one of the most efficient channels for our website as well. Right now, we’re in the middle of discussions about creating TikTok content. I believe it can be a very valuable platform for the SaaS environment. I know it sounds awkward.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, I think it could be. TikTok is very visual. It allows you to present a very specific answer to a very specific question in one minute.
It creates an immediate relation between the person representing the brand in the video and the person watching it. That’s the nature of TikTok.
Formally, it’s not a platform for work like LinkedIn. People are more relaxed. So the impact can be even stronger, because on LinkedIn you expect a brand to give recommendations while essentially promoting itself.
On TikTok, it doesn’t feel the same. It can create a stronger sense of trust.
I think we should try a prototype and use the dopamine effect of TikTok to create the necessity for people to go to your website.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes, but it’s also very hard to be recognizable on that platform. There are millions of pieces of content, and you have maybe three seconds to grab attention.
So yes, it’s hard to be recognizable.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, and the TikTok algorithm is very picky. If you’re not able to create engagement very fast and maintain it during the whole content, then you’re out.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: And I believe its algorithm is better than Instagram's.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Probably yes. I’m not such an expert. One of my future guests will be Laura I. Abreu, who is very experienced with TikTok, Instagram, and social media, and how to use them for SEO. So, I’m looking forward to learning something from her.
But yes, it’s interesting that TikTok could be a good opportunity for a SaaS like Designmodo to explore.
Using Email Marketing to Test SEO
Gianluca Fiorelli: And talking about more classic channels, maybe the oldest of all, email marketing—newsletters and so on—I remember you were also speaking about creating synergy between SEO and email marketing. Can you explain that a bit more?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes, sure. I don’t know if you agree with me, but I think email marketing is maybe in the top three most effective channels.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: But it alerts people when they are interested in it. SEO is for everyone. You are trying to grab attention before people arrive on your website. But email marketing works for SaaS when people are already interested, when you have already influenced them.
When you combine these two channels, it becomes a powerful combination.
SEO is distributed right now across many platforms, like social platforms and communities. But email marketing can also include SEO if you build your strategy that way. They can support each other.
I use email marketing to understand whether our email content is beneficial for our SEO efforts and whether it supports them. And also the vice versa.
So, when you use content from your documentation inside your email content, you can track its efficiency. You can measure email performance and understand whether you are positioning that documentation correctly. And then you can rethink if your strategy should be to insert documentation into your email content.
I know, it may sound complicated. But when you start thinking about combining these channels, you become more creative. They allow you to try different things, and there is no real risk.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, if I understand correctly, you can use your newsletter to present new documentation you’ve created. Then you can evaluate its effectiveness based on visits.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes. For example, with titles, you can run A/B tests before changing your meta title. You can use different versions of a title in your email content, see which one gets more engagement, and then update the main title in the documentation accordingly.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, it’s very cool. Usually we think about this kind of testing only in relation to ads, and it’s nice to see that it works just as well with newsletters.
And considering what we said at the beginning of our conversation about returning visitors, this is a very good test. Because newsletter subscribers are all potential returning visitors.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes, exactly.
International SaaS Strategy: Revenue-Driven Localization
Gianluca Fiorelli: Cool. And one last question is about international SEO, which for me, when it comes to AI—let’s call it International AI search SEO—is quite screwed up because of how the same LLMs work.
But there’s also a more foundational issue I see, especially with SaaS. Obviously, every business wants to expand internationally. But one common problem is localization.
Not the quality of the localization itself. Often the translation is very good; they don’t make big errors in this sense.
The real problem is localizing the pain points within a local market. For example, a tool may solve a general problem. But what are the specific problems that really matter for Spanish users, or German users, and so on?
Sometimes I miss this kind of localization in SaaS. Is it just me, or do you agree with this diagnosis I often make?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: To be honest, I’m not an expert in local SEO, so maybe my thoughts are not fully accurate. But I believe localization is more difficult than going international.
Gianluca Fiorelli: I wasn’t thinking about local SEO in that sense. I mean, for example, Designmodo offers solutions globally. But how do you really target different intents and interests between all the things, all the solutions?
For instance, maybe a certain type of solution is more appealing to US designers compared to others because they tend to be more interested in that specific approach.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Now I got it. Yes, I’m sorry; I just understood what you mean. I just got distracted.
So yes, I look at the main audience and where they are coming from geographically. If the main audience is coming from the US, then my focus is not from a traffic perspective but from a revenue perspective.
If my main customer segment is living in the US, then my main geography should be the US. I generally focus on that one big local perspective.
From my point of view, our budget and time are very limited. So I can’t divide my attention across multiple countries and audiences if they are not…
Gianluca Fiorelli: If they are not positively affecting the revenue.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes, exactly. If I see any impactful, revenue-bringing countries or geographical locations, then I should consider producing more localized things for them. But for now, that’s not the case, at least for me.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Interesting. Yes, it’s all a matter of prioritizing time, the effort, and also the budget.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes. Previously, in my previous company, we shifted our geographic focus. We moved from the US to Turkey because we had a very valuable network in our country.
We thought that if we were losing our US purchase channel, then we could try focusing on Turkey and leverage that network. And it was quite successful.
We actually created that audience from scratch. Our main focus has been the US and the international market. But then Turkey became the main focus, and it worked. It wasn’t something that already existed. We built that audience.
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From Introvert to International Speaker
Gianluca Fiorelli: Okay, let’s stop talking about data, AI, and search. Let’s talk about Bengü.
First of all, congratulations on your mug. Masters of the Universe is coming out as a movie soon, so perfect timing. I really like it.
Anyone who follows you knows that you are passionate about exercise and the gym. But you also love traveling. I’ve noticed you travel a lot for SEO conferences and meetups. And this year you’re speaking at some events in the next months.
So how much is speaking at a conference or going to a meetup also an excuse for you to travel and discover new places?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes, it’s true. It’s a little treat for me to travel for SEO conferences and other events. It’s also an excuse to see my SEO friends.
And about the mug, it was a gift from my best friend. I always choose this mug when I have a podcast or an interview. It’s my charm. Thanks for noticing that.
Gianluca Fiorelli: And talking about friends in the industry, I always say the SEO community is probably one of the most friendly communities.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Exactly, that’s true.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Of course, sometimes there are small envies, chit-chats, discussions, and disagreements. But most people working in SEO and search are very friendly.
Since you collaborate with Yagmur in Search ‘n Stuff, what recommendation would you give to the introverts of SEO? The ones who want to be part of a community but feel uncomfortable going to conferences or meetups?
How would you convince them to try, to be part of a community in a more active way, and make it satisfying and helpful for their growth?
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Thanks for this question. I think I might be the best person to answer it because I was once an introverted person. And I believe I’m still an introverted person. But when I’m around my people, my favorite people in the SEO industry, I become the most extroverted one.
Gianluca Fiorelli: That’s typical of an introvert. "Introvert" is not the same as "shy."
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: But I am also shy.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Well, then you are a dramatic and very successful case.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Yes. I was thinking a lot about socializing. I was very afraid of being judged by other people, especially other professionals.
Then I discovered the Women in Tech SEO community, which is a very warm and welcoming community. I became a member and realized that the community is very peaceful.
After that, I wanted to jump into the conference experience and not overthink it. I promised myself not to overthink and not to worry about being judged by people.
As a Turkish professional, it’s not very easy to go outside the country and join international conferences. You feel like a foreigner. But I thought I should challenge myself if I wanted to enlarge my network. I want to be an international SEO, and I want to work for foreign companies, as I am doing currently.
So I thought being introverted was an obstacle for me. I needed to push myself to meet more people.
My first attempt at being more extroverted was at the Women in Tech SEO conference. And I’m not regretful about that. Actually, the opposite.
Now it’s much easier for me to decide to go somewhere and join an event. Being a speaker is not something I feel completely relaxed and comfortable about. I’m not saying that. I still have that anxious and introverted mindset. But now I’m braver when it comes to deciding what is better for me, even if it’s not comfortable.
So I recommend people push themselves, even if they feel uncomfortable. That’s the first step. Once you take that step, the rest comes more easily.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Yes, I totally agree. For me as well, in the past, I had a similar situation. I’m Italian, living in Spain. So at the beginning, it was quite complicated, also because of the language barrier and so on.
If I have to add one more tip to yours, I would say this: for people who tend to be “shy”, or who downplay themselves and think they are not as good as the people they follow on LinkedIn and other platforms, don’t care.
You are not obliged to write one blog post every month or every week to prove how good you are, because you surely are good at something. But engage.
I remember my first year, I was very active during the golden age of Moz. I was always commenting on Moz articles. That helped me not only become known, but also grow my confidence.
Even if I thought I might say something wrong, I didn’t care. That’s the beauty of the search community. People are not there to judge you in a destructive way. They might say, “Maybe this is not correct,” but they are not attacking you.
That gave me the confidence to discuss everything related to SEO without being afraid of being judged. Of course, judgment is inevitable. But, don't care. Start commenting and entering conversations, maybe first in a virtual way. Those virtual conversations will give you the confidence to start real-life conversations with people.
So yes, I’m really happy that you overcame this, or at least partly overcame it, because you never completely stop being an introvert. But I’m very happy, because you are definitely one of the most solar members of the community.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: Thank you.
Gianluca Fiorelli: Okay, thank you, Bengü. Thank you for being our guest today, and I hope to see you soon, hopefully in real life at some event, or virtually as always.
Bengü Sarıca Dinçer: I’m sure we’ll see each other very soon at some event as an excuse to see friends. Thank you for having me on your show.
Gianluca Fiorelli: You’re welcome. And thank you to all of you for your patience and for following me, and especially Bengü today.
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Podcast Host
Gianluca Fiorelli
With almost 20 years of experience in web marketing, Gianluca Fiorelli is a Strategic and International SEO Consultant who helps businesses improve their visibility and performance on organic search. Gianluca collaborated with clients from various industries and regions, such as Glassdoor, Idealista, Rastreator.com, Outsystems, Chess.com, SIXT Ride, Vegetables by Bayer, Visit California, Gamepix, James Edition and many others.
A very active member of the SEO community, Gianluca daily shares his insights and best practices on SEO, content, Search marketing strategy and the evolution of Search on social media channels such as X, Bluesky and LinkedIn and through the blog on his website: IloveSEO.net.
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