Topic: Updating large projects

Due to the fact that many of our customers are having problems updating large projects, I decided to post this information here so that everyone can see it before posting a question related to it.

Google, Yahoo and other search engines have implemented a system to protect themselves from automated querying. There is no way to get past this system, other than play nice, regardless of what tool you are using. And we can't do anything about that, because it is implemented on their servers.

To comply with this requirement, Advanced Web Ranking has a "human emulation" feature that adds a random delay between queries so that you will not get banned by the search engines. This does not mean our application is slow. These delays are made on purpose, and you can see them in the Performance tab of the application options.

You can disable or decrease these delays (although I strongly recommend against this) and you can see for yourself how fast the application can be. Especially if you increase the number of simultaneous connections. But you will soon see that the search engines are no longer returning results to you, because your IP address has been banned.

My point is that these delays are there to help you. Without them, you can't query the search engines reliably.

Please allow me to show you some facts.

Let's assume the delay between queries accepted by Google is 15 seconds. If we divide the number of seconds in a day by 15, we get 5,760. This means that the maximum number of times we can query the Google search engine in a day is 5,760 times. If we have the search depth set to 5 pages, we further divide this number by 5 and we get a maximum of 1152 keywords that we can check per day.

Yahoo for example, is more restrictive. The minimum amount of seconds between queries is set to 25 by default. Doing the same calculation as above, we only get to check 691 keywords per day.

Not to mention that if you have two Yahoo search engines (Yahoo US and Yahoo UK for example) in your project, the application will only query one search engine at a time, thus dividing the number of keywords you can check in a day by 2.

Let's take an example. Let's suppose we have a project that contains about 1000 keywords, the Google and Yahoo search engines and a search depth of 5 pages. Using the calculus above, it will take more than 1 day to completely update our project.

Not very impressive you would say! But is the Advanced Web Ranking application the bottleneck here? I believe not. And all other similar applications present the same problem because of the way the protection system is implemented for each search engine.

The good news is that Advanced Web Ranking has a solution to this problem. You can speed up the updating of your project by querying the search engine from multiple IP addresses.

There are two ways to do that:

1) use multiple proxy servers (each with its own IP address) to make the queries
2) split the project into smaller ones and update them from different computers running Advanced Web Ranking, all connected to a centralized database using Advanced Web Ranking Server.

For more information about Advanced Web Ranking Server please see:

http://www.advancedwebranking.com/server.html

The reason why this works is because each computer has a different IP address, which tells the search engine that it's a different user. Thus you can divide the time it takes to update a number of keywords by the number of computers that are updating.

You can also make use of the APIs that Google and Yahoo provide, although they may limit you on the amount of queries you can do per day.

I hope the above information helps understand why these delays are needed how one can overcome this issue. Any comments or suggestions related to this issue are welcome.

Philip

Philip Petrescu
Advanced Web Ranking Team Leader
http://www.advancedwebranking.com

Posted 3 years ago

Philip's Website

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Re: Updating large projects

I just posted a topic that might help schedule out updating large projects.

http://www.advancedwebranking.com/forum … -time.html

Posted 3 years ago

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Re: Updating large projects

Great information Phillip, I completely hear what you're saying. Thanks for explaining.

Scott

Posted 1 year ago

MrShock's Website

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Re: Updating large projects

Thanks Philip:

I appreciate the details. Being a 5 year user of AWR, we here appreciate the Default timing settings.
To adjunct this, we created 10 private proxy servers 3 years ago. (Our projects usually have 300+ keywords)
Since April, however, Google has set Much stricter update parameters than the Default settings.
We have added a 7 minute sleep after 2 failures.
Even still, we gets many bans during an update.
Last week we added 5 private Proxies from Trusted Proxies. The many update errors continue!
Today, we are going to signup for 10 Private Trusted Proxies.

BUT, THERE IS A MUCH GREATER PROBLEM:
Version 8 consistently reports 45 to 50% fewer page 1 rankings (Keyword Ranking Report) than version 7.
Both have exact same settings. Both are current updated versions.
The versions NEVER are running at the same time, as they cannot.
We always run an update on Vers 8 first, tally the results, then shutdown Vers8, and run the same update on version 7.5.
We have a really old Support Ticket, with many, many examples: Ticket #202732
Still, there is no resolve.
NO MATTER WHAT WE DO, VERSION 7.5 shows more complete Page 1 rankings than Vers 8.0. Usually Double.
We virtually cannot use version 8 with this ongoing and unresolved problem.
Our clients would go nuts!
PLEASE HELP!
Thanks, Greg

Posted 12 months ago

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Re: Updating large projects

gregs wrote:

Thanks Philip:

I appreciate the details. Being a 5 year user of AWR, we here appreciate the Default timing settings.
To adjunct this, we created 10 private proxy servers 3 years ago. (Our projects usually have 300+ keywords)
Since April, however, Google has set Much stricter update parameters than the Default settings.
We have added a 7 minute sleep after 2 failures.
Even still, we gets many bans during an update.
Last week we added 5 private Proxies from Trusted Proxies. The many update errors continue!
Today, we are going to signup for 10 Private Trusted Proxies.

BUT, THERE IS A MUCH GREATER PROBLEM:
Version 8 consistently reports 45 to 50% fewer page 1 rankings (Keyword Ranking Report) than version 7.
Both have exact same settings. Both are current updated versions.
The versions NEVER are running at the same time, as they cannot.
We always run an update on Vers 8 first, tally the results, then shutdown Vers8, and run the same update on version 7.5.
We have a really old Support Ticket, with many, many examples: Ticket #202732
Still, there is no resolve.
NO MATTER WHAT WE DO, VERSION 7.5 shows more complete Page 1 rankings than Vers 8.0. Usually Double.
We virtually cannot use version 8 with this ongoing and unresolved problem.
Our clients would go nuts!
PLEASE HELP!
Thanks, Greg

--------------------------

Hi,

I had the same issue with AWR 8.1 breaking when updating large projects. When I do a small scale test on scheduling multiple small projects, it run fine, but as soon as I place quite a few, it breaks and the proxies wold fail to gather results. Hence why we cannot use 8.1 just yet, except to set up some fancy settings that only 8.1 can do.

Gregg, we also purchased from Trusted proxies and had similar issues with error proxies previously. But after several correspondence we discovered that rebooting the proxy connection from the Trusted Proxies side works! Try and request for a reboot next time smile

Posted 10 months ago

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Re: Updating large projects

Sorry for my late reply.

We did some update improvements, so please install the latest patch, build 11 and tell me how it goes.

Best regards,

Robert

Get in touch with us on Twitter: http://twitter.com/awebranking
We're also on Facebook: http://facebook.com/advancedwebranking

Posted 9 months ago

Robert's Website

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